Adventure Game Puzzle Design

[JD]

Let's discuss puzzles in adventure games. I wanted
to make a list of all kinds of puzzles. It's nearly 2am
here and the ones that I can think of right now are:

Conversation puzzles:
Saying the right things will get you an item, or access
to a new area or something.

Mazes:
Argh horrible! Reminds me of the bamboo jungle in
Larry 3 or the streets in QFG2 (but at least you could
get a map).

Simple item puzzles:
Getting Item X for mr. George, and he will give you Item Y
in return.

Correct order:
Three levers. Pull them in the correct order and a door will open. Wee!
I think Indiana Jones 3 had a puzzle like this with a piano, but
I could be wrong.

Timed puzzles:
Sierra seemed to like these. The puzzle can be pulling some
levers in the correct order, but with a time limit (ie. a ceiling
slowly coming down or something).



Anyone else who wants to add something? I'm going to bed  

[Damien]

Timed(?) puzzle
Like in full throttle, you had to kick the wall at the right moment (when all the metters lite green) to find a secret passage

Escape puzzle
When you are trapped in a room and need to get out (6 day assasin, litle johnny evil)

[Inkoddi]

Puzzle puzzles:

When you have to get various items and put them in the right places

[Squinky]

My favorite kind of Puzzle (which may be addressed already in one of it's other forms) is the distraction puzzle. It's where you have to do some kooky thing to distract somebody (obviously) and whats cool about it is you can usaully mix in a timing puzzle and a recipe puzzle (Which is just what I call a typical gey three items to make a potion/voo-doo doll puzzle, which is my second favorite)

Of course the distraction puzzle is just a good way to spritz up an adventure game staple, the guard or locked door type puzzles...

I think a good way to keep puzzles from getting boring is to apply a few different puzzle types to your one core puzzle, and to make sure they fit within the context of the game, and add something to it besides playtime....

[DGMacphee]

Blake Speers is the doyen of puzzle design:

http://www.mattgoble.com/interaction/ags/features/f03.htm

and

http://junk.dk/puzzle/

[Miez]

On a COMPLETELY unrelated note: your avatar is hypnotic, Def ... sooo cool!  

[JD]

DG you scoundrel! I was looking for Blake's puzzle design
thingymajig. Thanks  :

<offtopic>
And yeah miez, the avatar rocks! Here's the larger (original version) :



W00t!
</offtopic>

I also liked the Hanoii puzzle in Kyrandia 2: Hand of Fate. It's just that I
like the whole hanoii thing so that puzzle was enjoyable. I can understand it
could be quite annoying though if you dont like hanoii.

[Mats Berglinn]

Hey I just came up with a puzzle that haven't been discussed neither here or Blake Speer's list. I'm not sure what to call it but I would call it Timing puzzle.

In Escape from Monkey Island (don't blame me for mention it just because you hate that game) you had to throw rocks into a series of canals in order to make a huge boulder fly and plunge into the lava-field. You were suppoused to toss the rocks into three diffrent canals (left, right and middle) but in order to get a rock in the middle end (which won't work otherwise since the rocks only roll left or right) you had to make a rock bump on another rock to change the direction. In order to make the rocks bump is to toss the second or thrid rock at the left canal at the certain time. Now, here in the cliffs there roots at the canal which shakes as the rocks roll pass them. That gives you the clue to when to toss the rocks into the other canals. If you toss the rock the second before or the second after the root shakes the rocks won't bump into each other and therefore thay won't get the rocks into the right place so it's much about timing in this kind of puzzle.

[BerserkerTails]

The building puzzle.

For example: You need to catch a fish. Instead of getting a fishing rod, you combine a stick with some piano wire and a popcan top. Instant fishing rod.

[Paper Carnival]

In Escape from Monkey Island (don't blame me for mention it just because you hate that game) you had to throw rocks into a series of canals in order to make a huge boulder fly and plunge into the lava-field. You were suppoused to toss the rocks into three diffrent canals (left, right and middle) but in order to get a rock in the middle end (which won't work otherwise since the rocks only roll left or right) you had to make a rock bump on another rock to change the direction. In order to make the rocks bump is to toss the second or thrid rock at the left canal at the certain time. Now, here in the cliffs there roots at the canal which shakes as the rocks roll pass them. That gives you the clue to when to toss the rocks into the other canals. If you toss the rock the second before or the second after the root shakes the rocks won't bump into each other and therefore thay won't get the rocks into the right place so it's much about timing in this kind of puzzle.

Well, I'd name this as mini-game puzzle

Exploration puzzles: Like in S&M:HTR or GK. You have to talk to people, examine items etc to find new places to go in, which appear in the game map.

Clue Puzzle: When you have to search in a lot of places to learn how to solve a puzzle. The Monkey Kombat in MI4 is a combination of mini-game and clue puzzle

Collector's Puzzle: This is very usual in games and often the main objective. You have to collect pieces of a specific object you need, or objects which can be used as the two keys to open a gate. The quest for the four map pieces in MI2 is an example. Or in TR:AOD (please don't ban me for mentioning this crap, as not only it's not adventure, but it's not even a game ), where you had to collect three ID cards from some guards to open a door.

[Arasan Nayamu]

(It's a good thing I checked out this thread, cause I was gonna start one just like it.)

Okay.. thing is.. I read the Application of Puzzle Theory Written by Scarpia and he/she says, I quote, "...after having lurked around in the community for a while, it has surprised me how little this topic is actually being discussed."

This does NOT surprise ME in any way. I'll tell you why no one discusses puzzles much...

NO ONE WANTS TO GIVE AWAY THEIR IDEAS! DUH!
I sure as hell am not going to explain my amnesia based plot and the numerous puzzles that I used in my D&D game, cause I might want to make my D&D game into an AGS game! Why? Cause then you'd all know the fuggin solution! And the point of that would be?! LOL  

Getting back on track, I also read the bit about Red Herrings being a pun or puzzle in Blake Speers' Puzzle Theory and I have the best example for that. Not really a spoiler so you can relax. In Sanitarium, Chapter 2 there is a fishing shack with a sign. The sign has no words and has the symbol of a fish. The fish is painted red. You don't know how many times I laughed my socks off watching my fiance time and time again see if anything was useful in that fishing shack. In the end, after he finished the chapter I told him what was so funny. Nothing possibly could have been useful in a fishing shack with the red herring sign.

He just groaned while I continued laughing.

[Esseb]

Here's the first thread about it on the ags forums I belive. Coincidentally it was my first one as well. Laugh at the newbie.

http://www.sylpher.com/OldForum/Theory.htm

[edmundito]

If you have a Gamasutra account, read this: http://www.gamasutra.com/features/designers_notebook/19980313.htm

This is what you should NOT do

[Arasan Nayamu]

This is what you should NOT do

You could have copy/pasted the article and made it a quote, but the registration was free and the info that you said it was about things you should not do in a game sounded pretty valuable so I registered to see the article. I have to say I do not have faith in this article much... there are lot of blatant opinions in this without valid backup. I agree with a few of the ideas but the whole of the article is just an opinion (and a horrible lack of knowledge). However, one must remember that this article is about game genres as a whole, not just adventure games. Some of the things the writer explains DO work for adventure games and have been known to be enjoyable.
Here are my peeves about the article.

"Somebody gave me a copy of The Legend of Kyrandia a few years back, and I played it with some pleasure â€" right up until I got to the maze....."

Haha. That's funny. My favorite aspect of that game was the maze! No joke!  
It was done very ingeniously with the fireberries that went out after a while and left you in the dark. I thought that was hilarious. I still have the original map that I drew out for myself somewhere around here.. It's got pushpin holes in each of the grid squares cause I had it pinned on the wall and I used the pushpins as markers of where Brandon was in the maze. That has got to be the best maze ever created and I know there are other people out there that like mazes in games so don't go saying it's the worst thing to put in a game. That's just an opinon. The way you go about the maze is the key to a good maze. For me, Kyrandia's maze takes the cake! I loved it then and I love it now! I still play Kyrandia just to brush up on my memory of the maze and see how often I don't get eaten by cave creatures without the map.

"Mazes don’t have to be boring and stupid. It’s possible to design entertaining mazes by ordering the rooms according to a pattern that the player can figure out. A maze should be attractive, clever, and above all, fun to solve. If a maze isn’t interesting or a pleasure to be in, then it’s a bad feature. "

HUH?? How was Kyrandia's maze not clever or patternless? He must not have understood the fireberry's significance or something.. or maybe he's talking about some other maze in the game?? I can't think of one..

"A Switch in One Room Opens a Door In Another Room A Mile Away
Nor does it have to be a door â€" I mean any item which affects a game obstacle a long way off. Doom was guilty of this a lot, but the worst example ever was in The Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy, an Infocom text adventure. In that game, if you didn’t pick up the junk mail at the very beginning of the game, it was unwinnable at the very end. "

*cough*
Can anyone tell me the significance of the number 42??  
Seriously though, the radioplay/book/show was filled with rediculous irony, I'm sure the game had to have some too. I think this part of the article is justified just because Douglas Adams was a genious. I about spit my pop out onto my moniter laughing at this article writer's idiocy. I mean, who hasn't read Hitchhiker or at least heard of it??!! It's FILLED with IRONY. (my favorite chapter coming to mind being about the Spirit of Agrajag) It's going to have an ironic ending! I think what he thinks is the lack of an ending, might just BE the ending of the adventure! And it's a damn good one knowing Hitchhiker..  

I am not saying this particular aspect of gaming is not frustrating in the least, and should be avoided of course, but... this is Hitchhiker we're talking about and if you KNOW Hitchhiker you'd find the ending ironic and funny, not frustrating in the least.  

"Kill Monster/Take Sword/Sell Sword/Buy A Different Sword/Kill Another Monster"

Dude, this is again an opinion. I happen to like playing with this aspect of a game. Being able to sell and trade stuff to get an uber item is fun to me and to a lot of people that play D1, D2 and DSiege, as well as countless others. Mmmm.. Arcanum is cool too. Only certain sellers bought certain things at certain prices. I thought that was neat. It was logical too. Armories didn't buy potions for instance. Only alchemical shops did. Not really a concern for adventure games, since most money usage is 'rail-roaded', but I have to say that this is not a horrible aspect to a certain genre of game. Just a horrible opinion.  :

"You Have 30 Seconds to Figure Out This Level Before You Die."

Understandable in most games, but you know.. Lemmings comes to mind. That series of games was BASED on timed procedures and it was fun! Again, another blatant opinion.  : Besides, if you can save at the very beginning of a timed scene that's all the better. CMI you fall down a cliff and have to use an item in your inventory to save your fall before you plummet to the water below. At least you don't die but you have to go all the way back up the cliff, talk to Ozzy (I think that was his name) and then try again. But this usually works in an adventure game! So careful about saying that this article describes what you shouldn't use in an adventure game cause it's not just about adventure games.  :o

"Stupid Opponents
Another thing I’m tired of is stupid monsters who lumber towards you until you shoot them."

Agreed in most cases, but Blizzard did an excellent job in this area. There are monsters that interact with other monsters, call other monsters, revive other monsters, run away when hurt or leader is felled... etc. But true on most cases like I said. I've got a demo to a game I'll never buy just because the monsters in it are dumb as oxen. They only attack once you are within range... so you could stand there  within ten feet of them shooting arrows at them while they are walking back and forth and back and forth endlessly... with no retaliation whatsover. The demo is not on my computer even anymore. Damned if I can even remember what it's called.

"Neat, Tidy Explosions
Look closely at a picture of a place where a bomb went off. It’s a mess. A real mess. Things are broken into pieces of all sizes, from chunks that are nearly the whole object, to shrapnel and slivers, down to dust. And they’re twisted, shredded, barely recognizable. Things that are blown up by a bomb don’t fall neatly apart into four or five little polygons â€" they’re blasted to smithereens."

Okay, now I think this guy is just getting picky. Dude, it's a computer game! Not reality! Explosions and deaths are not going to be real! That's the point! If people played GTA to learn how to kill... maybe then you'd make it a lot more real but it's NOT for that! (at least I hope not) It's a way to let out pent up anger and frustration mostly. At least that's what all the guys that play it tell me it is for. I mean, you blow shit up in a game, and it's just for kicks! Get a life and quit analyzing the size of polygons for cripes!  : : :

"Scott Kim tells me that I’m being a bit harsh by labeling some of these misfeatures as “lazy” puzzle design."

Hmmmmmmmmm... I wonder why!
This guy needs to get a life. Do I say that too often?  

[Mats Berglinn]

I came up with a kind of varriant of mini-game puzzle. In Sam & Max: Hit the Road, you have to play Whack-a-rat game where try to whack about 20 rats before the time is up and you with a lamp which is a necessary iventory item. The same goes for Gator golf except for you have try to think about how to make the crocodiles form up so Sam can reach Max.

At least you don't die but you have to go all the way back up the cliff, talk to Ozzy (I think that was his name) and then try again.

That's the wrong name. The liftguy in CMI name is LaFoot. I think you confused him with Ozzie Mandrill from EFMI.

[Grundislav]

Howzabout the ol' trial and error puzzle?

I'm specifically thinking of a puzzle in "Runaway" in which you have to figure out a code of musical notes.  Just by trial and error you have to figure out the correct sequence of notes by identifying 5 notes and what order they go in.

It's a real time-waster, and it's pretty frustrating, but I guess it could be considered clever.  I personally found it annoying.

[TheQisSilent]

One of my favorite type of puzzles, just because of how big of a relief it is when you solve it, is the combined Misdirection/Bypass puzzle where they make you think you'll have to do a huge, enormous task, but in all actuality it's really nothing.  A great example for this is in MI2 where you would get to the huge door to LeChuck's castle that had huge padlocks and all that, but you just had to go through a smaller hidden door.  What can I say, it's funny!

[Paper Carnival]

It's a real time-waster, and it's pretty frustrating, but I guess it could be considered clever. I personally found it annoying.

Yes, but solving such puzzles is very satisfying

[Esseb]

I disagree, they just make me uninstall the game.

[Cerulean]

I'm not sure how many trial-and-error puzzles there really are. Often, if you've solved a puzzle by trial and error, it means that it was harder to find the real clue or pattern that you were supposed to pick up on and follow than it was to hammer on it like an ape and get lucky. A designer needs to be careful to make the puzzle's defenses secure enough that it's better to seek and find the solution. This is particularly the case with mazes, as it won't even occur to most people to recognize a method or pattern to a navigable maze when they know all they have to do is explore every passage.